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Tokyo the Glaive
Posted by Tokyo the Glaive
08/29/08 - 12:04PM
Stories have specific ratings for reasons, guys. If there's a story listed as Adult+ and you're only 16, guess what: you shouldn't read it. About a year ago, an influential and amazing author actually left Lunaescence Archives, taking all of her fantastic work with her, because of these problems. People who were younger than 18 were reviewing her Adult and Adult+ stories. I have to admit, I side with her opinion on this matter. Until there is a better system of checking everyone for ages, she won't put her stories back.

Still. The people here, at least, should be responsible enough to read stories for their ages. It's one thing if your parents let you buy books that have adult themes or happen to be explicit--but don't bring that here. It just shows a complete lack of maturity, especially when it is so blatantly advertised your real ages.

In short: don't read stories that don't belong in your age range. Thanks for reading this, for everyone who has done so. If anyone has anything to add about this--most of us have had this experience, I'm pretty sure--go ahead and fire away. I'm sure any questions anyone has can be answered here as well.

 

Comments
There'll never be a better system of checking people's ages. There can't be. Not one that any adult would agree to, anyway - no, there is no way in hell I'd give the mods of any fanfiction site permission to look at my credit record to prove I was over 18, for instance.

But yeah, I agree. If you insist on having an online persona that's older than your actual age, nobody will ever know. But it's really disrespectful to flaunt that you are ignoring the site's attempts to keep fic age-appropriate. Sad that an author had to take her fic down over it, though. IMO the rules-violating reviewers should have been kicked off if it was known that they were underage. That's what happens on every other site I'm aware of.
- cathrl on 08/29/08 - 05:58PM
I remember once that I got the e-mail notification that one of my favorite writers wrote something, so I checked it out. When I read halfway, I was like, O.O;;.

It's kind of hard to tell whether or not a story contains a lemon when they don't tell you the rating in the e-mails, nor are the summaries are really specific... If possible, could the e-mails in the future include the rating of the fics? That would be really helpful.
- magerm on 08/29/08 - 07:07PM
On a vaguely related but still somewhat relevant topic--

When posting a story, please make sure you give the appropriate rating. I've seen fics that are easily 13+ or 17+ misrated as being for "All." If it has any questionable material at all (language, violence/blood/gore, sexual situations past Disney-level innocent kissing, then it probably should not go into the "All" or "Youth" ratings.
- crazydominodragongirl on 08/29/08 - 08:51PM
To cathrl:

In all actuality and frankness, there is another way: the same way that fanfiction.net fixed up their site. They created the adult version of fanfiction.net, one where you have to (online, of course) sign a legal document stating that you are above a certain age. I'm not saying that we need to implement that, I'm just saying that there are ways to better keep track of ages.

As for the users getting kicked off, I didn't get any names, and the author who left--who was a mother with her own children, hence her strong reaction--didn't mention anything. I personally have been looking through reviews to make sure everything's clean.

To magerm:

I personally have never encountered what you have, although I do agree the problem should be fixed. I do wish one of the higher-up moderators would come and read this; if they did, they could fix this issue.

To crazydominodragongirl:

Thank you lord almighty that someone else has noticed this problem as well. I didn't mention it, but this is also a large issue. With my stories--and with other authors I've spoken to--I always go for the higher age group, if only to be on the safe side. I think people don't really understand what the ratings actually mean, and so they pick "All" as a catch-all. It's not.
- Tokyo the Glaive on 08/29/08 - 09:07PM
>_>
On a semi related topic, aren't there authors younger than 18 writing stories with Adult ratings? Because I think I've seen that here and there. (Not very often but I know I've noticed it at least once and been like O_O!)
Um yeah, just bringing in another similar problem. (Not too big though, I'm sure most of them can't get past the validation system.)
- DragonSilk on 08/29/08 - 09:32PM
For me, I'm always safe with ratings. My minimum rating is 13+, because I just feel like none of my stuff is really Youth or All. I just tend to be paranoid about that kinda thing.
- Chrys on 08/29/08 - 10:10PM
For the whole age rating thing, its most likely teenagers. Teens tend to do things like that. But thereís nothing you can really do. I say let just let them do what they want. There are age ratings, which means they obviously know what theyíre going to read. Itís none of your concern, itís the parents that needs to keep an eye on their kid. Or be less strict because this may be an attempt at going against a super strict parent. Plus teens have are very hormonal, and as such will read things that tend to be perverted. Thereís nothing we can really do on the matter. We cant really get in trouble though, because there are warnings. You willing put your writing on the internet where it can be viewed by anyone, so of course there may be people who shouldnít that do. But like I said, thatís not your problem. So, yeah, thereís my input.
- Reitas_emo_lover on 08/29/08 - 10:26PM
At Reitas_emo_lover:

I understand where you're coming from, and that it really isn't our problem. There's just one tiny detail:

It's against the law for the teenagers to be doing what they are. The Child Online Protection Act forbids it. Although we can't be held accountable because of the warnings, it is against the laws of the United States for them to be viewing that kind of material, parents or no.
- Tokyo the Glaive on 08/29/08 - 10:38PM
....Are 17+, Adult, Adult+ stories going to be going away soon? Talk like this always scares me. T_T;;;

And on a topic similar what DragonSilk said, if you are underage and writing something that is Adult+, would you get in trouble on this site?
- LatonaSelene on 08/29/08 - 10:51PM
At LatonaSelene:

I highly doubt that 17+, Adult, and Adult+ stories will be taken away. In fact, I doubt this news piece will have much effect at all beyond what it's already done.

I think you'll get in trouble, if you're caught.
- Tokyo the Glaive on 08/29/08 - 11:05PM
Even if you make it so young people can't read smut, they will, if you make it so their age will be detected and they'll be rejected, they'll just make another profile old enough, and what about young sight visitors? with no profile? hmm?
- pandahuggles on 08/29/08 - 11:19PM
xD; That's probably because I was never knew what a lemon was, so when I read, I was overwhelmed. I was also scarred for life, and went, "PEOPLE ACTUALLY WRITE THIS STUFF?" D;

I think, on the forums, it was discussed that people without accounts won't be able to see some stories rated a certain rating or higher...?
- magerm on 08/30/08 - 12:17AM
I honestly think it's a bit worse that a lot of the explicit, sexual fanfiction is written by people under the age of 18... o_o;
- apples4ryuk on 08/30/08 - 02:02AM
I don't think making people sign "legal documents" online has the slightest effect. Just look at how many young kids have myspace accounts - and how many parents think it's perfectly fine for them to have them. The vast majority of my daughter's friends have one - she's 12. I'm considered the evil queen mum of forever for making her abide by the rules. But the site requires that you declare that you are the correct age - I think it's 14. People don't care what they are signing. All a site owner can do is make it completely obvious what the ratings are. If they're not in the emails, then maybe they should be (or maybe you could choose what ratings of fics you want to be sent emails about)

And I'd have to agree with apples - the vast proportion of adult-rated fics I've seen (in general, not here) are by underage authors.

The other thing which, IMO, encourages people to read unsuitably rated fics, is people giving their fics far higher ratings than they deserve "just to be safe" (again, not here, in general). It's not safe at all, quite the opposite. If you have to go into Adult rated fics to find anything with actual consequences in it (for instance, in fandoms where people get hurt and die), of course anyone who is looking for a serious story is going to do so, and some of those people won't be adults yet. They will then encounter actual Adult stories along with the YA type material they were looking for. You can't expect teens to read Disney-level happy ever after stories all the time online, not when they're reading Catcher in the Rye in school. You can't expect 12 year olds to only read stories where nobody ever gets hurt, when their favourite book series is Harry Potter.
- cathrl on 08/30/08 - 06:00AM
@cathrl: I'm only answering the second part, because I am lazy and don't feel like thinking or whatever, and I honestly have no idea how to resolve the issue of underage authors reading/writing adult fics, or even if it should be resolved. As far as I can see, that's partially a matter of censorship, and partially another matter entirely (as it might bring up the argument why shouldn't they read/write it when they might have already experienced it, underage sex, etc., etc. -- not my opinion, but just what could be said).

But once again, it just goes to show you that they should rate their stories appropriately. There's an explanation of ratings on the FAQ page or somewhere around there, and I've always just associated Luna's system with the G/PG/PG-13/etc. rating in my mind; I think most people have seen enough movies to then rate their stories appropriately. This has been partially discussed in the forums before. It is not a matter of what they are accustomed to reading; it's also protection for Lunaescence, as a site that hosts adult material where minors can potentially access it.

Also, I feel obliged to point out here that these are my opinions and not necessarily reflective of the opinions of Luna as a whole or Luna's mods/admin. (Or maybe I just feel like saying that.) Also, standard disclaimer that I am over eighteen goes here. XD
- crazydominodragongirl on 08/30/08 - 07:22PM
There is honestly no other way of knowing someone's age besides trusting what they say when it is online. It is easy to get around birth date request by simply putting your birthday then add on a few years.

I hate that it would be like that. I always try and rate my stories appropriately though I know the younger generation do read them so I generally try to keep the content somewhat clean. I do hate to do that though. I want to write for myself and other people, not write for a certain age group. I feel like I'm muffling the content of the story.

Here's a thought. Perhaps a system that locks your birthday in. (Assuming you posted your correct birthday) it would hide stories from you that were rated higher than your age group.

I'm only suggesting that because most people when they sign up for a site such as this may not think such a thing would happen and may post their actual birthday.
- Rei on 08/31/08 - 08:32PM
I don't really understand this age thing because simply speaking; no one knows who you are. You could be some twelve year old, while you could also be a twenty-three year old. This is the internet, people lie on it all the time.

What I believe that I understand off of this is that people, who shouldn't be reading things, are reading it. I can't say that it should be regarded as high as it is. The world these days are maturing earlier, causing mistakes to happen. Most of the adult ranges are usually lemons, but then there comes the question of: "Aren't teens becoming pregnant when they're young?"

The teens should know what they're waltzing into because it warns them before the story opens. They are at their own liability because there indeed is a warning. I know that kids realize what theyíre getting into when they read adult stuff, but as much as we wouldnít like that to happen, kids are going to do it anyway.

All you can do is offer warnings, but even if you do, I doubt that many will listen. I know itís also rather disturbing that kids are commenting on stories that they shouldnít be reading it in the first place, but maybe itís possible to make it where accounts under the age limit cannot post a review? Something to that extentÖthough Iím thinking that more will lie and make their accounts older than what they are. Itís like no matter what youíre trying to do, kids are rebellious these days and sometimes youíre just going to have to deal with it.

You have the warnings, but kids go in it anyway. Thatís their problem, not yours. Iím sad to hear that a good author left because of that, but what can they or you do?
- Akiko on 08/31/08 - 10:17PM
I feel a bit awkward posting here as I'm only 14... but I totally agree with several of the points on both sides. So I guess I can speak for some of the teenagers...

So, where to begin... you're right on most points. I sit in class and listen to what website my friends have lied on... in 6th grade everyone who had a myspace told me to get one and just put my age as 18... 7th grade it was go to the adult section of Fanfiction.net and read some amazing lemons because 'we've already done it'... in 8th grade it was put your age as 18 so you can write us lemons... of course, to all of these I refused because one: I myself find lemons sickenning (probably because i'm only 14), two: I have self respect, and three: it's illegal (or should be...). Anyways, my point is that most of my generation could care less about warnings, and will find some way around whatever you try (be it changing their age or using their parent's information for any legal stuff [some even know their parents social security number...]).

That being said, I also agree that something needs to be done... I don't like accidentally stumbling upon a lemon... my fault for browsing the 17+ stories for a good angst maybe. But if I couldn't even look there wouldn't be a problem... so what about a separate rating for lemons and sexual content that is blocked from underage users but still lets us get at the other things?

I'm rambling and I feel awkward posting this so I'll finish it up... sure some teens are going to try and get past whatever you guys get up, but not everybody... I'm perfectly happy leaving lemons alone. I found the Quizilla protest rather hilarious since I got sent a petition because I was in the age group protesting...

What I'm trying to say... if you care at all... is that some of us do play by the rules (for the most part) and don't look at the things we shouldn't (unless excessive violence counts...). Hope it wasn't a total waste of time...
- Shade on 09/01/08 - 10:29AM
The big problem with requiring date of birth at sign-up is that when they figure out it hides a certain range of stories is that they'd simply make another account. Then, they'd simply warn their friends to add a few years at sign-up.

In the past, some adult-oriented archives have required authors to fax them a copy of their driver's license or state ID. Again, not foolproof and a potential invasion of privacy. Plus, who's to say they didn't find a friend 18+ to let them borrow it for this purpose?

Like cathrl said, we could do credit reports, but there's no way people would want to share that and I'd feel like scum requesting it.

About all I can do is have faith my visitors are responsible.

I've been trying to determine ways to further emphasize that these are mature stories. I'll see what I can do about adding more information, like ratings, to the author alert messages. But aside from guidance, I'm not sure how much I can actually do without full cooperation from everyone who visits this site. >_<
- Sally on 09/01/08 - 01:06PM
Ugh, I hope you guys donít make a separate site just for sex. Do you know how awkward it is on adultfanfiction.net?! When you want an actual story that just HAPPENS to have a lemon in one or ten of the chapters? Not everyone likes rated G romances. But it's horrible trying to sort through kinky stuff and yaoi and odd fetishes to find a nice, solid plot that has a nice lemon in it. (No offense intended towards those who are into it.) And a lot of great stories have ONE lemon in them so they have to raise the rating. Theyíd be forced to change sites because of the ONE lemon that may flow beautifully with the plot.



Do you know how terrible it would be to have all the great fanfiction migrate to another site (again)? I donít think I can stand reposting my own stories, let alone try to find the ones I loved before that never even got completed. For people who have had to move from Fanfiction.net to mediaminer.org to e-fiction to fosff then back to e-fiction when the owners were finally overthrown then here to Luna when both fosff and fictionzone were deleted and destroyed with "FATALERROR_NOTCONNECTED", I donít think itís fair. With each move there are less and less reviews because people have already read them and donít feel like re-reading it to see if itís back up to speed and arenít showing the author that hey, people are still interested and want to see the story to the last chapter. Itís a real motivation killer.



If anything, I think that people should be made to have a login to view any story that is above PG-13. Yes, they will lie about their age to read higher rated stories, but by forcing them to use an email address the law can recognize the actual attempt to keep minors from Ďharmful contentí and whatnot. Thereís only so much you can do about the issue. And say that someone is reported for being underage and reading something explicitóyou can block the user and the IP Address, right? DeviantArt does it. I donít know the specifics, but I think itís when no one from that home may create another login to get around the block.

If it can be done, I think itís a lot better than having to move to a different site for the tenth time and having to repost for the thousandth.
- KitsuneYoukai42490 on 09/02/08 - 01:45AM
Ugh, the comment above mine reminds me of how horrible all the various moves were.

Lots of good stories got lost every time too. =/ Never to be posted again.

ANYWAY, a lot of people are talking about how hard it is too look for decent stories that have a high rating for subject matter other than lemons and erm... I'd like to remind them that THERE IS AN EXCLUDE OPTION. At the top of each section you can choose to exclude lemons. So assuming that everyone labels their stories correctly that solves THAT problem. ^_^
- DragonSilk on 09/02/08 - 05:41AM
I agree with your comment, but I have to say as a Mom. My children are monitered while on my computer. That includes my teenage stepchildren. I also have parental controls sat to prevent them from goin to sites they have no business looking at.
- bitchgoddess on 09/02/08 - 08:43AM
I know this isn't the place for it, but I'm so lost. I have sent messages to this websight (I don't know who gets them) but no matter how many messages I send I never get replies! It's driving me crazy. I was validated, then unvalidated, I have no idea why, I thought once you were validated that was that. I didn't do anything wrong! People are trying to make this sight so friggen perfect yet ninety-nine percent of the stories I read have spelling mistakes and some are so obvious! I want to read and write at a more mature sight than quizilla which is full of bad writers, and fanfiction is hard to find things I'm looking for, but this sight can be so irritating. I try to perfect my stories but no! The nitpickers have to be impossible, you have to fail at least fifty times before you can be validated, and when you are, nope, we're taking your validation away for no reason. Once my story was turned down, and I waited a few days before re-submitting it (I hadn't edited it) and it was validated! what's with that? I can't take it anymore! why don't you just make a ranking chart where poor writers are ranked lower than better writers so validation is easier, and make it so the story submitter thing has a word catcher that catches spelling mistakes before they're submitted so if there are any they can't be submitted! Sorry to rant but this was the last place I could find. no one replied to my messages I sent months ago, and weeks ago etc... I really am sorry if I sound like a super bitch. I'm just so frustrated!
- Introvert on 09/02/08 - 08:46PM
@Introvert: There are two kinds of validation on this site (and you spelled site, wrong, by the way). There's chapter validation, and there's author validation. In your case, it's probably chapter validation, meaning they said your chapter was free of errors, thus they validate it. However, they don't know much of your style yet, so they don't validate you as an author, if that makes any sense.

Also. Not everyone is prefect. There are some things that escape many others. You can't expect all stories on Luna to be perfect. There's only a general guideline, and if a story has some minor mistakes that may have been caused by a typo or so, then it's most likely validated because the story seems readable, etc... and not just a pile of mess or so.

There are different mods that go through the stories, so each of them would probably have a different idea of what kind of standards to be used, which is probably why your story was accepted.

And, with writing, it's an art form. One author's style is different from the others, so it would be difficult to rank. I'm also pretty sure that the mods run the works that are sent in through a spell checker, but they don't change it for the author.

I'm pretty sure that there's also some kind of annual fic clean-up, in which mods go through the site and look at stories that shouldn't have been validated got through, and remove those. However, it is to my understanding that this has been delayed for a reason.

And I have two suggestions for you. Once, you could have tried going to Luna's forums and inquiring about your story. There are many helpful people on there.

The other is that if you want to rant about spelling errors and capitalization and all that, then you should try to edit your own rant before submitting it. It just seems to weaken your argument when you spell website and site wrong several times. I'm not trying to bash you or anything, if that's what it seems like. I'm just stating what I think.

Well, I hope that this somewhat helps you a bit.
- magerm on 09/02/08 - 09:06PM
Ha-ha, I know what you mean Introvert, they never reply to my messages either.

Anyway, I don't get why some people are so sensitive about the adult stuff. Are you going to shelter yourself until you're 18 and then suddenly go on a crazy sex rampage? Don't take that seriously. I know it can be a bit much for some people, but some people are also very mature for their age. All of my highschool friends have at some point read a sex story, some said "never again" and some said, "All the time, not a big deal, not like I do it in real life. "

If you're going to go with the default "NO, they'll think it's ok to do it in real life, they don't know any better" argument, don't bother. I hate when adults are condisending like children have no independant thought and only grow brains suddenly when they turn 18. Especially because some have lived sheltered lives or may see things differently than other people and act all authoratative. No, i'm not a rebell. I just don't like the "I'm older which makes me more powerful than you lecture." I've met some adults who I'm smarter than. Just saying. It's not like it's not going to happen some time or another, and it shouldn't really do so much damage that the person can't function. sheesh.
- pandahuggles on 09/02/08 - 09:08PM
@ Magderm

AHH! Are you serious? "Writing is an art form."
"You spelled site wrong." What? You think I like to write and know nothing about it? I was ranting, and I don't try to make my comments the most perfect friggen thing when I'm mad! Most of you are so high up on your horses, come back down to the real world. I spell something wrong and by the tone of it you love rubbing it in my face so you can pat yourself on the back smugly. "That person must be stupid because she was mad and spelled something wrong, I'm so much smarter!" You think I haven't tried looking in forums? You think I haven't tried asking people? You take writing too serious. STOP. Before you even try to hop up there again and say. "You obviously don't care that much for it since you would say that." You are wrong. I love writing, I write every day even if no one will ever read it, and I plan to make a career out of it. I may not be the best, yet, but I'm still young, and plan on getting much better. Stop saying crap like, "Everyone has their own style, I'm not trying to bash you" I now all that! Stop trying to explain simple things I already know!

I have written comments like yours and it in the back of your mind it IS indeed a bash, a little jab at me because I spelled a word or two wrong. Someone! Please! Erase my profile, I'm tired of this SITE and all these stuck up people! I'm going to make my own site, where people will actually want to go and won't spend all of their lives just trying to be validated. I understand you may say, ďYou must not be very good a writing if it truly takes you so long blah blah blah. I do take pride in my writing and want it to be at its best, but when none of my friends and not even my computer can find a mistake in my writing and I'm still not validated, yes, I would want to go elsewhere! Especially with the poor stories aloud here to be read for ever and never taken down, because I can still find them now! If this sight isnít perfect it should stop trying to be so friggen perfect!

I realize now most of you probably think Iím an ignorant bitch who is upset that I didnít get my way. You donít know me so I can do nothing about that. Sorry if you view me this way, but there are others on this sight like me who just havenít voiced it yet or never will, guess Iíve ruined my name for some. Good bye.

PS: I could come back with another name and be a great writer, and those of you who call me stupid on this name, could praise me on my other name. So donít be so quick to act so overly smart. Don't reply to me if you're going to be condisending please. and thanks for the small tid bits of help. Doesn't help much though.
- Introvert on 09/02/08 - 09:37PM
Look. I'm sorry if you think that it was a bash. I'm just simply stating what I've gathered about the validation and clean-up process, amongst various things here.

As for the other things directed at me, I won't answer those, because I don't want to start a fight at the comments section.

Sorry once again.

As for the spelling, I was just pointing that part out so if you ever rant in the future, it would make your rant more persuasive and understandable. It's just that you spelled site wrong several times in your rant, so I can't help but point it out.

So, sorry once again.
- magerm on 09/02/08 - 09:45PM
@ Magerm

I've cooled down now, and would like to say something.

I'm so sorry! AHH! I feel like such a bad person for everything I said! My friend was sitting next to me saying, you should point this and that out, and I was mad so I did. I'm sorry! Lesden, lo siento, gomen ne sai! I was so mean! I can't even believe I said some of those things! I actually made myself gasp!
- Introvert on 09/02/08 - 10:49PM
Well........that was awkward

Back to the original problem, I think it is the reader's own responsibility of reading lemon or NC17 things, however the law won't see it that way, the website will be blamed. I saw a website, showing NC17 manga (not porn just storyplots with adult content in it), being taken down that way, because a mother blamed that site because her kid was freely and willingly browsing it.
- Kyoyama Kita on 09/02/08 - 11:22PM
@Kyoyama Kita:

Yes. Yes. THANK YOU. That's what I was trying to say before. Frankly, it does not matter whether or not people under 18 think they are mature enough to read what they want. It is not a matter of the mods or admin being sensitive about what people read. I do not actually care about preserving minors' virgin eyes. I do not care if they feel that they can handle it, or if it's nothing that doesn't happen in their everyday lives. The fact of the matter is that it is still in violation of the law (somewhere... probably), and while they won't get in trouble, the sites that host such material will. It's not a matter of protecting them so much as it is a matter of protecting us.

@Introvert:

Please, please, please try to remain civil when speaking to others in the community. I know you were angry, but still, courtesy and respect should be maintained. And in response to your first comment: if you're having trouble getting in contact with anyone through e-mail, the forums are always open; several mods browse them on a daily basis and would be willing to answer any questions you might have. If you can't find anything in an already existing post, then make a new post of your own; you don't even have to have an account. Whether or not a story is validated, especially if it's kind of borderline, definitely depends on the mod reading it. And I'm sorry, but fixing your stories (or finding a spellcheck or a beta-reader) is really up to you. (We're pretty backlogged on submissions already; we don't have time to go through and correct things for people as well. Firefox has a spellcheck if you want to use that.)

Basically, my advice to you would be to see if you can find a beta-reader that you can trust. Friends aren't always the best choices, since a lot of them aren't likely to be writers and may not be as good as you want them to be for proofreading. You can always look through posted stories on the archive, find one that has few errors and that you like, and see if the author accepts beta-readers. :/
- crazydominodragongirl on 09/03/08 - 12:51AM
@crazydominodragongirl:

I completely agree. You need to ask people's ages when they sign up, you need to block people who say they are underage from fic too old for them, and you need to warn for all stories with age limits.

What you don't need to do is check that they are not lying about their age when they sign up. That's their parents' job.
- cathrl on 09/03/08 - 11:53AM
I really shouldn't even talk, since I do admit to reading Adult and NC-17 stories and might get in trouble for this (I'm 17 if it helps me any), but I guess you guys are right. I wouldn't want my 13 year old sister, who read a cute Kingdom Hearts G rated romance fic and thus liked fanfiction, to read a lemon by accident, like it happened with me. That's actually what got me into reading them. Not on this site, though. It was before, in between one of the many moves between sites. There's so many I've lost count and don't know which it was.

Being only 2 months away from the magical 18 I can say I'm not going to stop reading them, but that some of the ideas you guys have sound interesting. You could pull a DeviantArt and block the higher rated stories so that you can only see the summary. You could pull a GaiaOnline and just make an ERROR page when you click on a story you can't read (they do this when you try to create an account that's younger than 13. Happened to my sister a little while back. It became unlocked on her birthday.)

If you begin asking for more data, I think you might lose members and not win that many in the future. I'd have to leave. There's no faxes in my house and I wouldn't look for one just to send you data my parents wouldn't want me to share over some dumb fanfiction, and I'm from Mexico, so anything you might ask from me (social security number, driver's licence or whatever) wouldn't match your data specifications.
I'd also just find it too much of a hassle and probably leave anyways. I fear many would do that too. It'd be horrible to see another site die down for another dumb reason. (Though, from the legal point, it's not really dumb.)

Someone said that maybe they should have accounts to be able to see the higher rated fics. I also agree with this. DA does something similar and blocks the higher rated pictures from non-logged-in computers as well as too-young viewers.
- ShadowsAndLight on 09/04/08 - 12:39AM
I don't know for me I think it's a maturity issue. Say for instance a 16 or other underaged person reads a "dirty" story. Sure they aren't supposed to, but just about everyone knows they will if it's something they want to read.

On a lot of the sites I frequent they either ban inapproriate stories and such the like or they make it clear that they have no responsiblity for the underaged readers that may cheat the system and read it anyways.

I think if we needed a system to help a good start would be the birth date. Say put in an underaged birthdate automatically, but make it to where it is changeable. When someone with an underaged birthdate tries to get the story it pops up a warning saying you are under 18 and can not go past this page.

Sure it won't stop everyone, but it's a start. -If this site already uses a similar technique then hey you're amazing and on top of things.- It's just an idea.

I know what it's like to be an author that has written stories not meant for those under 18 and not being able to post some of them just so I didn't have a problem like the person who left the site.

However I know that a fair amount of my 'questionable' writing was written when I was still a freshman in high school. It all just really depends on the person and their maturity level. I don't necessarily think it's so much an age factor. My opinion doesn't so much matter since this isn't my site it's just how I feel I guess.

And if you are underage and you know it and the story says that you can't read it. Do the right thing and turn away. You don't want to be remembered as the kid banned for reading explicit stories.
- darknessfaerie07 on 09/04/08 - 06:49AM
Ignore me if you suddenly think I'm ignorant or stupid, but I think age shouldn't matter.
Some people hit maturity sooner in life or can handel lemons and limes.

Like on my website, which I posted since deviantART is too strict now-days, I let people write or draw what they like even if they aren't over 18 and posting or reading stuff in the mature section of the forumns.

I don't really mind it much. All I'm asking is that if you think you're mature enough to do this, than do it! But I will kick you out if you prove yourself not mature enough to handel adult shit.

I'll say that I think I'm mature enough to handel shota, loli, incest, yaoi, yuri, lemons, hentai, blah blah blah! I feel like I've been that way when I turned eight. At that age I was able to understand how to handel mature stituations approiately *kill me for spelling wrong, just do it!* without whining or going "Ew!" or start screaming my head off at sex or violence.

On the violence behalf, I have eight and six-year-old brothers. Both of them watch movies like Silent Hill, Resident Evil, etc. And my parents watch it with them! Fuck, my brother's favorite movies are the Saw series!
The crap gives me nightmares for weeks!
The point made is they understand in their heads that it isn't real. My parents have taught them that there's no such thing as zombies and while you may get chained into a basement and have to cut your own foot off someday, it's most likely only gonna happen to 1 outta a million folks!
But my brothers look at sex still on that young kid way.
"Ew!"

The point is commenting on this was that maturity is always changing! I know a good friend who can write these really well written, lemon filled yaoi Death Note stories. People love them and still know she's not 18 yet!
But if she hadn't looked at yaoi and lemons maturily, she would'a been scarred for life and running home to her parents crying.

I look at lemons, hentai, etc. maturily, as does she.

If you want to be seen on a mature level, think. Just think.
"What do I think of this? Is it disturbing? Gross? Interseting? Arousing?"

Thank you for your time.
- LostSorrows on 09/14/08 - 04:35AM
Um, just a little random suggestion...

Perhaps people, very much like LostSorrow, thinks that you just need to be mature inside.

But, some people, much like Tokyo the Glaive, thinks that people underage shouldn't read stories that are not appropiate for them.

Well, honestly, I think that it's really up to the readers and their parents. Thus, it's really up to them.

However, as some people mentioned, having young readers read unappropiate things for their age causes the website some mishaps, then, maybe, just maybe they mods can change the way the website is working.

I very much like the idea of having the birthday check. However, many young readers fake them to have more acess to more things, like Neopets for example.

My little cousin is always on that website and although it changed, if you are 13 and over, you have more acess. Overall, many young readers fake their birthyear.

I'm not complaining. I'm just saying my opinion...

Does these information help any?
- never_say_goodbye on 09/16/08 - 01:25AM
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